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	<title>Comments on: The Thin Line of Theory</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?feed=rss2&#038;p=141" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141</link>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2164</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2164</guid>
		<description>Levi,

Did you see that the paper was dedicated to &lt;i&gt;Giordano Bruno&lt;/i&gt;? And that he paraphrased a Pete Seeger/Peter Paul &amp; Mary song?? And that there is not ONE equation in the entire paper?

The amazing thing to me - this guy was invited to MIT and CERN for 3 years each. Who makes these decisions? I wonder if these people know how to actually do any calculations?

-drl</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Levi,</p>
<p>Did you see that the paper was dedicated to <i>Giordano Bruno</i>? And that he paraphrased a Pete Seeger/Peter Paul &#038; Mary song?? And that there is not ONE equation in the entire paper?</p>
<p>The amazing thing to me &#8211; this guy was invited to MIT and CERN for 3 years each. Who makes these decisions? I wonder if these people know how to actually do any calculations?</p>
<p>-drl</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2165</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2165</guid>
		<description>We must keep this   from Ed, he&#039;ll be devastated. Poor fellow, he seemed so excited...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We must keep this   from Ed, he&#8217;ll be devastated. Poor fellow, he seemed so excited&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Larsson</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2166</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Larsson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2166</guid>
		<description>Peter,

I realize that it makes sense to spend for Witten to spend a year or two on the twistor string if he finds it promising. However, from what he writes (and that is my only source, I don&#039;t know anything about the subject first-hand) I most definitely get the impression that he doubts the project&#039;s viability. Now, I prefer to work on presumably correct projects rather than presumably incorrect ones, and I suspect that Witten thinks likewise. So that he works on the twistor string but doesn&#039;t believe in it seems to indicate that he doesn&#039;t have any attractive alternative.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter,</p>
<p>I realize that it makes sense to spend for Witten to spend a year or two on the twistor string if he finds it promising. However, from what he writes (and that is my only source, I don&#8217;t know anything about the subject first-hand) I most definitely get the impression that he doubts the project&#8217;s viability. Now, I prefer to work on presumably correct projects rather than presumably incorrect ones, and I suspect that Witten thinks likewise. So that he works on the twistor string but doesn&#8217;t believe in it seems to indicate that he doesn&#8217;t have any attractive alternative.</p>
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		<title>By: Levi</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2167</link>
		<dc:creator>Levi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2167</guid>
		<description>Chris W.,

Your link in the thread you reference is to the most bizarre paper I&#039;ve seen yet on the ArXiv. It&#039;s hard to imagine that Cumrun Vafa endorses the views in the paper, but who knows?  Besides the passage you cite, the author of the paper also thanks Vafa in a footnote on page 3.  In fact the paper is worth reading for the footnotes alone.  My personal favorite is footnote 4 on page 4, which correctly conveys the flavor of the whole paper:

although they could send unwanted anti-prisoners, their arrival being known as gamma-ray bursts</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris W.,</p>
<p>Your link in the thread you reference is to the most bizarre paper I&#8217;ve seen yet on the ArXiv. It&#8217;s hard to imagine that Cumrun Vafa endorses the views in the paper, but who knows?  Besides the passage you cite, the author of the paper also thanks Vafa in a footnote on page 3.  In fact the paper is worth reading for the footnotes alone.  My personal favorite is footnote 4 on page 4, which correctly conveys the flavor of the whole paper:</p>
<p>although they could send unwanted anti-prisoners, their arrival being known as gamma-ray bursts</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2168</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2168</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m deleting the last couple posts claiming the Pound-Rebka experiment was a fraud because they are off-topic nonsense. If anyone wants to discuss this with quantoken, do it at
http://quantoken.blogspot.com
not here.

By the way, R. V. Pound taught my advanced laboratory physics course, and was an extremely impressive scientist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m deleting the last couple posts claiming the Pound-Rebka experiment was a fraud because they are off-topic nonsense. If anyone wants to discuss this with quantoken, do it at<br />
<a href="http://quantoken.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://quantoken.blogspot.com</a><br />
not here.</p>
<p>By the way, R. V. Pound taught my advanced laboratory physics course, and was an extremely impressive scientist.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris W.</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2169</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2169</guid>
		<description>View this old &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/blog/archives/000073.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;post&lt;/a&gt; on this weblog, and use your browser to search for &quot;Cumrun Vafa&quot;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;Cumrun Vafa thinks that the fact that we do not see aliens around could be the first proof of the existence of brane worlds: all advanced aliens would have emigrated to better parallel universes (our Universe has zero measure).&quot; &#160;[-- Beatriz Gato-Rivera]&lt;/blockquote&gt;

If he seriously expressed this opinion it really says something about his judgment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>View this old <a href="http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/blog/archives/000073.html" rel="nofollow">post</a> on this weblog, and use your browser to search for &#8220;Cumrun Vafa&#8221;:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Cumrun Vafa thinks that the fact that we do not see aliens around could be the first proof of the existence of brane worlds: all advanced aliens would have emigrated to better parallel universes (our Universe has zero measure).&#8221; &nbsp;[-- Beatriz Gato-Rivera]</p></blockquote>
<p>If he seriously expressed this opinion it really says something about his judgment.</p>
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		<title>By: DMS</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2170</link>
		<dc:creator>DMS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2170</guid>
		<description>&quot;Also, so much of the (suddenly overhyped) particle &quot;phenomenology&quot; these days, a subject which cannot really be done without actual experiments, is simply string theory done badly.&quot;

This is a joke, right? In case you are serious,  LHC will falsify most (perhaps all) these models. That is a good thing. If you want to do something unfalsifiable, there are other subjects like theology.

The string theorists also show such appalling ignorance about particle physics: like Lubos&#039; statement (in his blog entry) that phenomenology deals with issues like &quot;adding new digits to the 3 x 3 neutrino mass matrix&quot;. Have they heard about oblique precision electroweak observables S,T,U (hint: nothing to do with dualities)? Do they even care? Details, details, to be worked  out later; everything is massless relative to Planck scale... There is a certain comfort in doing such work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Also, so much of the (suddenly overhyped) particle &#8220;phenomenology&#8221; these days, a subject which cannot really be done without actual experiments, is simply string theory done badly.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is a joke, right? In case you are serious,  LHC will falsify most (perhaps all) these models. That is a good thing. If you want to do something unfalsifiable, there are other subjects like theology.</p>
<p>The string theorists also show such appalling ignorance about particle physics: like Lubos&#8217; statement (in his blog entry) that phenomenology deals with issues like &#8220;adding new digits to the 3 x 3 neutrino mass matrix&#8221;. Have they heard about oblique precision electroweak observables S,T,U (hint: nothing to do with dualities)? Do they even care? Details, details, to be worked  out later; everything is massless relative to Planck scale&#8230; There is a certain comfort in doing such work.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2171</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2171</guid>
		<description>Lubos&#039; willfull misreading of Peter&#039;s funding comment is a pretty common &quot;technique&quot;, if you want to call it that, from usenet type flame wars.  It baits your opponent to go on the defensive, &quot;no, what I really meant was...&quot;.  Not the level of discourse one would normally associate with Harvard faculty (even untenured ones).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lubos&#8217; willfull misreading of Peter&#8217;s funding comment is a pretty common &#8220;technique&#8221;, if you want to call it that, from usenet type flame wars.  It baits your opponent to go on the defensive, &#8220;no, what I really meant was&#8230;&#8221;.  Not the level of discourse one would normally associate with Harvard faculty (even untenured ones).</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2172</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2172</guid>
		<description>Lubos,

My comment about funding was just pointing out what more than one person has told me.  They don&#039;t dare criticize string theory in public because when  powerful figures like Cumrun make it clear that they think anyone who criticizes string theory is a &quot;fool&quot; or a &quot;child&quot;, there&#039;s the implicit threat that they will oppose funding grant proposals by fools and children.

The story about Cumrun&#039;s reaction to the Nova program was told to me by a string theorist who heard him say this.

Thomas:
I don&#039;t think it is irrational for Witten or others to keep working on twistor strings for a while even though they have run into problems. They do get very useful tree-level results, and it&#039;s reasonable to see what else they can get out of this idea. If they keep doing it for twenty years though...

The real problem is that they don&#039;t have any other new ideas about string theory to work on.

Quantoken:

Please stop trying to turn the discussion here to your pet ideas about GR. I&#039;ll delete any further comments by you or anyone else about this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lubos,</p>
<p>My comment about funding was just pointing out what more than one person has told me.  They don&#8217;t dare criticize string theory in public because when  powerful figures like Cumrun make it clear that they think anyone who criticizes string theory is a &#8220;fool&#8221; or a &#8220;child&#8221;, there&#8217;s the implicit threat that they will oppose funding grant proposals by fools and children.</p>
<p>The story about Cumrun&#8217;s reaction to the Nova program was told to me by a string theorist who heard him say this.</p>
<p>Thomas:<br />
I don&#8217;t think it is irrational for Witten or others to keep working on twistor strings for a while even though they have run into problems. They do get very useful tree-level results, and it&#8217;s reasonable to see what else they can get out of this idea. If they keep doing it for twenty years though&#8230;</p>
<p>The real problem is that they don&#8217;t have any other new ideas about string theory to work on.</p>
<p>Quantoken:</p>
<p>Please stop trying to turn the discussion here to your pet ideas about GR. I&#8217;ll delete any further comments by you or anyone else about this.</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Larsson</title>
		<link>http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141&#038;cpage=1#comment-2173</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Larsson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=141#comment-2173</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;Ever thought about the concept of &quot;work in progress&quot;?&lt;/em&gt;

Work in progress on a non-unitary theory like conformal supergravity? Not really. Sounds kind of LQGish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>Ever thought about the concept of &#8220;work in progress&#8221;?</em></p>
<p>Work in progress on a non-unitary theory like conformal supergravity? Not really. Sounds kind of LQGish.</p>
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